Intercooler idea for Sprintex Supercharger

[Alexia]

I did some mock up with the Sprintex parts and figured out that it is possible to space the supercharger out from the manifold about 1". The outlet mounting plate on the supercharger is removable and is a custom piece for the XJ setup.

The idea is to reproduce the mounting plate with an additional 1" of thickness and incorporate a small 3"x3.75"x1" water to air intercooler inside of it with water fittings in the sides.

This seems like a task worth exploring, but what I am curious is if anyone has experience calculating the estimated efficiency of such a small intercooler? I also imagine it may only be efficient at cooling if it was being chilled inline with the AC system, but that itself would incur losses.

 

[SolarBell]

That would slick if you could make it work. I am looking at an outboard water/air intercooler myself. The core size on the unit I am looking at is 9.25" x 3.5" x 3.5" and rated (by them) for 350 HP.

http://www.frozenboost.com/product_...d=210&osCsid=9c73b0f942f4e92bce64014fe0b34641

The size you spec looks a good bit smaller (I estimate about 1/10 the size based on cubic dimensions) but any cooling is better than none.

Any thoughts on where you would put the radiator? I can't stack anything more on the front of mine.

 

[O-Gauge Steamer]

I would disagree here. A little cooling could lull a person into a false sense of security.

As I see it, an intercooler that small, even if the A/C system was charging it, would not be very effective. I do have to ask if one that small is even made? If so, what is the pressure drop across it? All intercoolers drop the delivered pressure to a greater or lessor degree. Generally speaking, the larger the intercooler, the less the pressure drop but this is not a "golden rule" as the actual construction of the device is what is the final arbiter. As in stacked plate or, fin and tube construction. Fin and tube having the least pressure drop of the two.

I looked very closely, indeed, into very this issue with my Sprintex installation and came to the conclusion that, even if an intercooler could be fitted, the performance of the compressor is the limiting factor. It just does not have the reserves available to make this work in any sort of acceptable fashion.

As some know, I am running a modified Sprintex installation utilizing a 54mm pulley and a 68mm TB against an otherwise stock 4.0L. This combination yields 8 pounds of boost here (6,500') which equates to 9.6 pounds of boost at sea level. As delivered, the Sprintex kit provided 5 pounds of boost...

Be advised that the claim that has been made of getting 12 pounds of boost is specious at best. Physics you know...

Alexia, are you not fitting the compressor to a stroked engine? This will drop the maximum boost roughly by the percentage of engine displacement increase. According to the Sprintex documentation, the S5-210 compressor is rated to be fitted to engines displacing from 1.8L to 3L. The only reason this compressor is in the Jeep kit at all was room under the hood. This kit had to pass the MOT standards of Australia and so, it had to fit under the stock hood. What should have been been fitted is the S5-335 compressor which has nearly (89 cuin/rev) the same performance as the Eaton M90 (90cuin.rev).

My advice, for whatever it is worth, is not to bother. If you are running a stroker, then you may want to consider the 54mm pulley. I have a thread here, on , on what it takes to fit the pulley as it does not just bolt onto the front of the drive as there is an offset issue at play that must be accounted for or the serpentine belt will jump off. Or, at the least, fail. To decision to change the pulley should be based upon the final performance coupled with the engined compression ratio. High compression engines and boost are a volatile mix...

One that requires intercooling.

 

[Alexia]

Marty sent me some information on kits for V8 engines that do the same idea. What is noted about them is that each kit is at least 2" thick to get adequate cooling. I originally said 1", but I did roughly measure that 2" would work. It may require switching to a different air intake setup or messing with the brake proportional valve placement.

 

[O-Gauge Steamer]

The idea itself, obviously, has merit. IMO, all forced induction engines require intercoolers.

Period.

There is room to slightly relocate the Sprintex compressor of you are willing to lose the Sprintex provided compressor intake manifold and build your own. As well as losing the factory Air Box for the filter. Sprintex was constrained to keep as much under the hood stock as possible. The need to Keep It Simple is also why there is not a new TB in the kit. Even though, the benefit of replacing the stock TB is huge. Costs were a pressing issue for Sprintex as well. For my part, I think they did well considering the restrictions under which they were forced to operate.

As I am a fan of ingenuity, I laud any and all attempts at improving systems. I operate under the assumption that no system is perfect. That all systems have room for improvement. Look at what has been achieved in my installation. The system, as delivered, produced 5 pounds of boost (barometric pressure dependent...) and is now solidly delivering 8 pounds. Temperature in the manifold that sits between the compressor and the cylinder head (discharge manifold) has been dropped by near 20(C) degrees by the installation of a Header Blanket and attaching self adhesive insulation to the under side of the discharge manifold.

It was discovered that, given the new nature of the "vacuum" sourcing, oil vapour was being drawn into the compressor. This vapour had the effect of lowering the Octane of the fuel. Installing an oil/air separator in the PCV line stopped this phenomenon and allowed the timing to be advanced a bit more (1 degree max) which resulted in increased performance.

My compressor performance is not that of a compressor that operates at sea level or thereabouts. With increased altitude comes decreased Mean Air Density. The partial pressure of Oxygen drops as well. It is a challenge to make horsepower up here at 6,500'...

Brakes. I suppose that, if money were no large object, that going full hydro boost might make a bit of room under the hood. Vanco makes a neat setup and all it takes is money...

 

[yossarian19]

...I operate under the assumption that no system is perfect. That all systems have room for improvement... all it takes is money...

OGS, I think you just nailed the opening line of the Hot Rodder's Manifesto.

 

[O-Gauge Steamer]

Well, let's see...

In 1959, my Dad, older Brother and I replaced the tired, worn out original flat head V-8 in our '40 Ford wagon with a fresh flattie out of the '52 Mercury (a superior version that) and then... We bolted on a Roots Supercharger with three 2 barrel carburetors.

Just because my Dad ran compressors on everything we owned.

My Dad is one of the "original" Hot Rodders, stared building cars in the late thirties. Back in the day when the norm was to install the largest possible engine into the smallest possible space. Think Caddy engines in Ford Anglias here. It was a very strange environment in which to grow up. Spent almost all of our free time under the hood of something...

I can remember way more than one firewall getting cut out and remade in order to fit something into the bay that clearly did not belong...

But, yes indeed, all it takes is Money, Skill and Force of Will. Almost anything can be done. Whether or not it should be done is another argument.

And yes the wagon was a Woody. What I would give to have that car today. Or, for that matter the '52 Hudson Hornet (with the "world famous" Twin H Power 308 cuin flat head 6 cylinder engine) I had in '69.

Keep in mind that in '59 the Ford was just a 19 year old POS as far as most people were concerned. In some cases, we were paid to haul off some of the cars we resurrected. Good luck finding those deals today.

I am willing to bet he did not pay more than $25 for it as the engine was well on the way out.