I smell fish.....

[Beezil]

Back on topic...

Not my line but.....

Thanking obama for killing OBL is like thanking ronald mcdonald for your hamburger....

Thank the guy who put it in the bag......not the clown

 

[5-90]

Anybody here ever get a full TS BI done by the govt ? I have, that you could get by not being born here is about 99% impossible. They came up with stuff I forgot.

Yah. I got the DIS report on me a few years ago, and learned stuff about me that I didn't know (and my buddies - half of them had been investigated for their own purposes, and I ended up with about half of their reports as well. They probably got the same things about me, if they requested their reports.)

But, how many pols are really subject to TS/BI, TS/SBI, or TS/SCI? I get the feeling there are people currently serving that have rather higher clearances than the President does - although for good reason. How much does POTUS need to know about daily operations, sources & methods, and things like that?

 

[Alienspecimen]

Not my line but.....

Thanking obama for killing OBL is like thanking ronald mcdonald for your hamburger....

Thank the guy who put it in the bag......not the clown

Did you just called the President of the United States a clown....?

With all the respect to the members of the NAVY SEAL team, but they are not the only ones responsible for the success of this operation...and it might come as a shock, but they arent the most significant piece of the puzzle either.

The team relies on information/intelligence, which obviously didnt collect. It also relies on funding for equipment, which obviously they didnt procure, also buncha other stuff...and most importantly, their mission had to be of some importance ie someone had to pay for them to be there...

Now, the person whom you just called a clown pledged that Osama will be brought to justice...and got it done. Without this complex mission being on his list, the seals would have never been there to put bullet in the head of the XXXXah...

What bugs me the most is not the fact that people would go through great lengths to deny that President Obama's "The Decider", but that we had to wait almost ten years for justice to prevail, because President Bush was truly not concerned about Bin Laden (go ahead and google it, Ill wait...just copy and paste...)

 

[96XJ9705]

SEALS put their lives on the line, analysts put their next pay raise, the president put very little on the line compared to the reward. The people who really put a lot on the line are the guys who interrogated the little SOBs that gave up the intel. They were right and still get prosecuted by a clown who doesn't recognize their value. Yes, I called him a clown because in this instance he is a sad clown. Other times he acts presidential and is called the president, but when he acts like a clown...

 

[Alienspecimen]

SEALS put their lives on the line, analysts put their next pay raise, the president put very little on the line compared to the reward. The people who really put a lot on the line are the guys who interrogated the little SOBs that gave up the intel. They were right and still get prosecuted by a clown who doesn't recognize their value. Yes, I called him a clown because in this instance he is a sad clown. Other times he acts presidential and is called the president, but when he acts like a clown...

Oh, s**t....I forgot the interrogators...I didnt actually, but thats not the point

So is it the guy who cooks the burger, or the guy who brings the products to the store...or the one who invented a great burger...

See, neither of these would be successful if someone didnt put all these pieces together. President Obama did not physically risk his life, but with his actions he prevented loss of life during the execution of a complex military operation.

He put the mission back on the list, planned the operation, identified the steakholders and got the "buy in", then went with the plan. Intelligence was part of the plan...but they all had to cooperate under his leadership, otherwise the plan was going to fail...

Honestly, I didnt fully understand what you said, but it seems that you also want to argue if torture is really effective. I think this is a different topic and if you really want to discuss it, you should start a new thread. My only advice is that you check Sen. McCain's position on the subject first...

 

[96XJ9705]

My point was who risked the most, they then get the most credit. The guy watching it on a screen gets less credit than the guy entering the room with a gun.

Cooking burgers works as an analogy cause the fry guy can actually get burned. The PR clown dances for the camera.

Obama didn't plan the operation, operators plan operations. He said bomb bad, lets send in troops. Then he watched. He didn't collect data, piece data together, or plan/execute operations. He made good choices on what they should focus on and to execute the mission. He made bad decisions when he put on big red shoes, danced in front of the camera, and said look what I did.

 

[Boatwrench]

The thoroughbred can't win the race without the draft horse plowing the fileds.

 

[Beezil]

Did you just called the President of the United States a clown....?

I sure as hell did.

 

[Alienspecimen]

My point was who risked the most, they then get the most credit. The guy watching it on a screen gets less credit than the guy entering the room with a gun.

Cooking burgers works as an analogy cause the fry guy can actually get burned. The PR clown dances for the camera.

Obama didn't plan the operation, operators plan operations. He said bomb bad, lets send in troops. Then he watched. He didn't collect data, piece data together, or plan/execute operations. He made good choices on what they should focus on and to execute the mission. He made bad decisions when he put on big red shoes, danced in front of the camera, and said look what I did.

Got it

I cannot speak on behalf of Obama, but can argue that he is the one who risks the most.

Risking your own life is one thing, while being responsible for the lifes of others is another...in my book. I might be a dying breed, but if someone lost his/her life during the execution of a mission/program I was ultimately responsible for, I wouldnt be able to live with the guilt if you know what I mean.

Things go wrong all the time. Programs/missions never run as planned. It is the job of the leader/manager to identify all possible risks and provide mitigation plans.

I agree with you that he didnt put every piece together, but thats not his job. He was the one who initiated the mission, put the team together (ie the buy in, because if people didnt support him, the plan was not going to succeed). As you said, his job was to keep them focused on the right mission. None of the pieces that constituted this team could do this alone. They not only needed to be put together, but also in the right order...Obviously it worked, because even with some hiccups during execution, ultimately, everyone came back and thats good planning, good decision making.

Listen...he isnt my favorite president either, although, I voted for him. But I think that you are little unfair when you put him dancing in red shoes, because in all statements on the subject made by him that Ive seen, he always acknowledged the level of sacrifice the members of the seal team had made.

 

[RichP]

Got it

I cannot speak on behalf of Obama, but can argue that he is the one who risks the most.

Risking your own life is one thing, while being responsible for the lifes of others is another...in my book. I might be a dying breed, but if someone lost his/her life during the execution of a mission/program I was ultimately responsible for, I wouldnt be able to live with the guilt if you know what I mean.

Things go wrong all the time. Programs/missions never run as planned. It is the job of the leader/manager to identify all possible risks and provide mitigation plans.

I agree with you that he didnt put every piece together, but thats not his job. He was the one who initiated the mission, put the team together (ie the buy in, because if people didnt support him, the plan was not going to succeed). As you said, his job was to keep them focused on the right mission. None of the pieces that constituted this team could do this alone. They not only needed to be put together, but also in the right order...Obviously it worked, because even with some hiccups during execution, ultimately, everyone came back and thats good planning, good decision making.

Listen...he isnt my favorite president either, although, I voted for him. But I think that you are little unfair when you put him dancing in red shoes, because in all statements on the subject made by him that Ive seen, he always acknowledged the level of sacrifice the members of the seal team had made.

This is a career politician we are talking about here, morals, ethics, public face, RE-ELECTION. All three of our houses are full of clowns and bad ones at that.