DD steering opinions...Heims or Tre's

[2001XJ]

So all legal issues aside, can you guys give me your opinions of using Heims or Tre's with a DD? I drive my jeep about 70 miles daily. I realize there are differences in steering kits out there and depending on design, some use Heims and some Tre's.

I am leaning toward going with Heim based steering for the responsiveness/tightness, however, I have heard there are some cons such as vibration transfer and sloppyness after wearing and they wear out faster then TREs. However, I don't want the "roll" or "deadspot"that usually accompanies TRE based steering setups.

TIA

 

[ktm racer 419]

heims and tie rod ends are both just as tight, its not like a tie rod end flexes like a bushing.

Whether or not your steering rill have that "tie rod roll" or "dead spot" depends on what kind of steering setup you use, it isnt dependent on the ends used.

The main benefit IMO to the tie rod end setup IMO are chevy one ton parts (which is what most everyone uses for their tre setups) are available at most any auto parts store.

I have also heard some super noisy heim steering setups as well. Could have been old, cheap, worn heims. I run 7/8" ruffstuff heims on my current rig, and its fine, no noise.

 

[jro780]

I don't know how much lift you have or what your wheeling preferences are, but I think it's hard to go wrong with the Currie Corrrectlync setup for a DD that wheels too. Plus it's straight bolt-in requiring only about 30 minutes of time.

 

[djlarroc]

i would go and (am gona go) with TRE for that much onroad driving.

i did heims on my zj (w 35") and didnt like it. so back to TRE for me. and x1MM on what ktm said about 1 ton TRE availability.

 

[clean4drxj]

I've been running m a 1ton utk setup with with regular chevy tres and it's been perfect without any noise for 4 to 5 years,just grease them every oil change or so.

 

[jeeperjohn]

I've been running the same heims for more than 3 years and have had no issues at all.

 

[Jeep450r]

i would go and (am gona go) with TRE for that much onroad driving.

i did heims on my zj (w 35") and didnt like it. so back to TRE for me. and x1MM on what ktm said about 1 ton TRE availability.

What didnt you like about the heims?

 

[djlarroc]

they felt sloppy. it was brand new steering and new steering box, and i just didnt like how it drove on the interstate.

 

[2001XJ]

I don't know how much lift you have or what your wheeling preferences are, but I think it's hard to go wrong with the Currie Corrrectlync setup for a DD that wheels too. Plus it's straight bolt-in requiring only about 30 minutes of time.

I have just over 6" of lift which I hear is absolute max for the Currie setup. Also, the currie is just basically a beefed up version of the stock setup so won't there still be the "roll" and "deadspot" issue?

 

[jro780]

I have just over 6" of lift which I hear is absolute max for the Currie setup. Also, the currie is just basically a beefed up version of the stock setup so won't there still be the "roll" and "deadspot" issue?

I'm at 6" of lift as well. I personally love the setup and haven't had any issues with roll or deadspot. I am also running a 1" drop pitman. I ran 80 mph out from Iowa to Colorado and back with no road issues at all. My Heep is buttoned up pretty well with all new control arm bushings and spring bushings, so there isn't any additional opportunity for slop in the steering. I personally like the factory geometry of the Currie setup but the other steering options are cheaper and appear to do a good job based on the experiences others have reported.

 

[zachandandy]

Stock set up doesn't have the roll, as it is inverted y. It does cause toe angle changes with suspension travel. Inverted t steering has horrible roll at taller lift heights. When I was running a Dana 30 in front, I ran the jb4x4 bolt on high steer arm on the passenger knuckle, allowing a seperate drag link straight to the arm and a solid tie rod from knuckle to knuckle. I also ran goferit inserts to flip the tie rod on top of the knuckles. No roll or dead spot, no toe angle changes and no bump steer. I did move the track bar axle bracket up as well. This was all done using stock size tre's. When I swapped in the 44, I also switched to heims. To me they feel tighter and beefier than tre's and show no signs of wear after a year.

 

[2001XJ]

Stock set up doesn't have the roll, as it is inverted y. It does cause toe angle changes with suspension travel. Inverted t steering has horrible roll at taller lift heights. When I was running a Dana 30 in front, I ran the jb4x4 bolt on high steer arm on the passenger knuckle, allowing a seperate drag link straight to the arm and a solid tie rod from knuckle to knuckle. I also ran goferit inserts to flip the tie rod on top of the knuckles. No roll or dead spot, no toe angle changes and no bump steer. I did move the track bar axle bracket up as well. This was all done using stock size tre's. When I swapped in the 44, I also switched to heims. To me they feel tighter and beefier than tre's and show no signs of wear after a year.

This sounds like a possible combination of the best of both worlds....crossover steering, higher tie rod location and TREs

 

[2001XJ]

so thinking of doing this:

crossover kit with offsett TREs for the tie rod and high angle TREs for draglink ends

using these to flip the tie rod OTK:

and this to mount the draglink:

overall it would look like this but with the tie rod mounted on top of the knuckle between the knuckle and bracket (assuming there is enough clearance)

of course I will have to move the sway bar mounts and track bar axle end mount. I think this will give me a great combo of clearance, driving geometry/response/lonogevity on the road and ease of getting parts using TREs. Total cost will be around $450-$500

what does everyone think?

 

[Vanimal]

interesting bracket. what do those 3 shorter bolts go into on the knuckle? not sure i'd want any leverage force on the heads of the unit bearing bolts like that, but depending on what those other 3 bolts do, it might be ok.

 

[2001XJ]

here is a more detailed picture sequence of an install...

Even though this would be around $500 all said and done (includes JKS OTA trackbar mount). I think it would accomplish:

1. Waaay heavier duty than other "upgrade" systems
2. Customer service and availability of ruffstuff is unmatched
3. Uses chevy 1 ton TRE which will last longer and are easy to find
4. Is the closest design to a "hi-steer" setup I have found in that price range
5. Cheaper and somewhat easier to install versus the WJ knuckle swap (plus stronger tie rod and draglink compared to aluminum ones)

 

[djlarroc]

wow, that looks interesting! i for sure thought the wj swap could be done less tho? i havent looked into the pricing of the wj swap, so not sure.

 

[Vanimal]

WJ swap would be stronger, with much better brakes. price should be similar, i think i have about 400-500 into mine with new ball joints and unit bearings, 1 ton TRE's steering links, etc.

Also, aluminum seems to be a better choice for a tie rod than DOM, i'm swapping my bent steel one out for a solid 7075 bar.

 

[Oatmeal]

Who makes this?.....how much $?

Hans

 

[GordoSmasho]

Don't know if this is going on a stockish axle but you will also have to relocate your trackbar and swaybar links as well. If that has been thought of already make sure you include that the price of this conversion.

On a side note Id see if it was possible to flip the tierod over the knuckle at the same time and get it up out of the rocks as well. It is the more vulnerable of the links

If you dont want to move your tbar and sway links might want to look at iron rock offroads otk heim steering. Seen it in action. works well and no other mods necessary. Says its good to 8" of lift and you can increase that with a drop pitman arm

 

[scoobyxj]

Stock set up doesn't have the roll, as it is inverted y. It does cause toe angle changes with suspension travel. Inverted t steering has horrible roll at taller lift heights. When I was running a Dana 30 in front, I ran the jb4x4 bolt on high steer arm on the passenger knuckle, allowing a seperate drag link straight to the arm and a solid tie rod from knuckle to knuckle. I also ran goferit inserts to flip the tie rod on top of the knuckles. No roll or dead spot, no toe angle changes and no bump steer. I did move the track bar axle bracket up as well. This was all done using stock size tre's. When I swapped in the 44, I also switched to heims. To me they feel tighter and beefier than tre's and show no signs of wear after a year.

So from all I can tell the Ruffstuff system is basiclly an inverted Y style like the factory system just heavy duty.

Is or has anyone run this on a DD? If so what did you think? Currently I'm at stock hight, but whenever I get a replacement DD, and can afford to enlarge my tire size I'll be setting close to 4"