did cluster (w/tach) swap and temp gauge not working

I'm new here...'94 2-door 5-speed 4.0 purchased last month.

Did some searching but thought I'd post anyway...

The Jeep's from Calif. and I'm in Canada so I wanted to go to KM/H and have the Tach, oil pressure, temp, and SMALLER fuel gauge. Got a '96 cluster from salvage and hooked it up (disconnected battery first), changed oil pressure sender to correct one, and changed temp. sender to the correct one (the one by the firewall on driver's side). Hooked battery back up and everything works fine except the temp. gauge.

- circuit tested just above the sender...lights up...okay so there's power there
- circuit tested back of cluster (purple with yellow wire)...lights up...okay so there's power going to the gauge (I think)
- upon ignition the temp gauge needle deflects to the right but then rests all the way to the left and then it just sits there, not moving at all...by the way, circuit testing causing the needle to flip over to the right similar to ignition time.
- hmmm...after running for a bit, valve cover is warm...rad cap is warm...air is warm in the cab when set to defroster and high fan setting...doesn't seem to be a thermostat.
- pulled out sender; dipped in boiling water...no change in gauge reading (circuit tested again to make sure there's power)...bit relieved since it's a false reading.

I'm gonna take the sender back to NAPA and exchange. But is there anything I could be missing? Anyone with a similar experience? Could it be a wiring issue? Doesn't seem to make sense...

I like this Jeep...wish I had one sooner!

Cheers,
Rian

Sounds like you have a bad ground there somewhere. Or the cluster that you got is bad.

Pete

Maybe they gave you the wrong one. Make sure they know you whave a guage and not a idiot light. Also you say "warm" air, engine and radiator. It's supposed to be "hot"


JoBo

JoBo said:

Maybe they gave you the wrong one. Make sure they know you whave a guage and not a idiot light. Also you say "warm" air, engine and radiator. It's supposed to be "hot"


JoBo

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Look where he's from, they might still be a bit cool up there :laugh3:

The 96 cluster may not be compatible with a 94. 96 was the first year of OBD-II, and I believe the OBD-II systems get the temp from the PCM, not from the sender on the head.

Hi, I just made my cluster Swap two weeks ago an work fine, the sender P/N is 56027012 for Mopar and TS-334 for Standard, good luck

Eagle said:

The 96 cluster may not be compatible with a 94. 96 was the first year of OBD-II, and I believe the OBD-II systems get the temp from the PCM, not from the sender on the head.

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I can see this is one of the better auto forums out there. Congratulations on 6 years of excellent progress for !

Checked part number at napaonline.com - should be the correct part, but I'm going to go and get another one right away anyhow.

I think the cluster is compatible because I bought it from our gov't salvage (socialist AND cold here!) place that uses an Interchange database. I also checked the most credible place on the 'Net: EBAY!

I guess the warm air, rad, etc. was relatively speaking after a few minutes. I would have gone the thermostat, cooling system route if I hadn't done the boiled water test...the gauge is simply not moving no matter what the input.

I'll check back later with a new sender...

Cheers,
R.

P.S. Are signatures on this forum somewhere?

If you are certain that the cluster is compatible, be sure they sell you a sender for gauges, not for idiot lights. The idiot light sender is just an ON/OFF switch. The sender for gauges is a variable resistance unit.

If another sender doesn't solve the problem, you can test the gauge by removing the cluster from the dash (I know how much you're looking forward to that) and attaching jumpers directly to the posts on the back of the gauge. One lead would go to the sender, the other to 12-volt power. (Dunno which post is which, but they may be marked for + and -)

This is probably good for posterity: I don't believe the '96 cluster is compatible (an EBAY'er has it wrong!). I went to three auto parts places and this time I asked for a temp sender from a '96, not a '94. No list. No sender for temp gauge past '95 at all three places. A wrecker has one from a '93 (with a million kilometers, but oh well). I'm going to grab that and try it with a sender.

I thought for a second about figuring out a work-around...yeah, just for a second. I'll let everyone know if the '93 cluster w/tach works out.

Cheers,
R.

I believe at some point there were two senders, one on the engine thermostat housing and another in the back rear driverside of the head. The one in the tstat housing was for the engine and the one in the back was for the gauge.
Just not sure of the year where they went to a single sender on the tstat.

RichP said:

I believe at some point there were two senders, one on the engine thermostat housing and another in the back rear driverside of the head. The one in the tstat housing was for the engine and the one in the back was for the gauge.
Just not sure of the year where they went to a single sender on the tstat.

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I'm guessing it was '96 for the single sender...someone alluded to this above. Just for interest's sake, there was a listing for '96 temp sender for dummy light, just not for gauge. The correct info. is probably buried here or elsewhere on the 'Net...but I read for an hour last night and today I'd rather go clean my garage

Cheers,
R.

easier way to test it is with a multimeter, the sender that is. set the meter to ohms, and do your boiling water test. make sure you start with cold water, you should see a smooth transition of resistance. I'm not sure of the baseline resistance or what the span should be, but if you see a smooth transition as the water gets warmer its good. if you see sudden large jumps or OL on your meter the sender is bad or you have a bad connection to it. double check your connection before you label it as bad.

my bet is the sender is good, and that the 93 cluster will work fine.

good luck

Here's a couple of write-ups I found useful. None of the "new" senders that I'm trying to hook up (a few from the wrecking yard, and one new part) are direct plug-ins to my existing ('96) harness. I got oil pressure working last night bycuttin'-n-splicin'...Had to get the sender and as much wire lead from the wrecking yard harness, then tie it into mine. Going to try for water temp tonight.

If you're going with new senders, Eagle's right. I spent twenty minutes with the parts guy, explaining about a '96 jeep, with a gauge cluster from a '91, not idiot lights. He finally found a part number for a '91 w/ gauges, but the top is a threaded post, and my harness has a weathertight push-on connection.

Cheers,

Steve

http://www.jeepbarracks.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=27

http://www.geocities.com/[email protected]/Gauge.html

SteveT said:

Here's a couple of write-ups I found useful. None of the "new" senders that I'm trying to hook up (a few from the wrecking yard, and one new part) are direct plug-ins to my existing ('96) harness. I got oil pressure working last night bycuttin'-n-splicin'...Had to get the sender and as much wire lead from the wrecking yard harness, then tie it into mine. Going to try for water temp tonight.

If you're going with new senders, Eagle's right. I spent twenty minutes with the parts guy, explaining about a '96 jeep, with a gauge cluster from a '91, not idiot lights. He finally found a part number for a '91 w/ gauges, but the top is a threaded post, and my harness has a weathertight push-on connection.

Cheers,

Steve

http://www.jeepbarracks.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=27

http://www.geocities.com/[email protected]/Gauge.html

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The 89 YJ I just sold this weekend has the threaded on connector in the back of the block on the head. It uses a single push on connector and while it's threaded the wire connector is a push on...

I have a 90 which had the idiot lights. I changed to the full guage cluster and, just like yours, the temp didn't work. This was after buying the sending unit for 90 with guages to replace my original "idiot" version.

What I've found out is that there was a change around 94, so you want to order a sender (full guage version) from a 94 or 95. After that, the guages changed again. The sender will have a different connector so you will have to find a plug with a short tail of wire attached to splice into your existing wire.

the part numbers I posted early are for gauge cluster from 92 to 96 according to Mopar.
check it at http://www.newjeepparts.com/Jeep-parts.htm

Okay...tried another auto parts place and, again, they do not list for a 96 (only up to 95). Both Chrysler dealerships in town did list one for 92-96 (as per posts above) - so I've ordered that sender and will try this tonight. Will post results.

Ya,
Rian

So the temp sender for a 96 didn't work. Will have to return. May have to return the 96 gauge cluster as a result.

Just for shiz n' giggles I used a jumper wire and connected the orange wire from the the coolant temp sensor at the front to the purple wire going to the temp gauge...I actually got a reading! The needle would sort of jump in pulses but it did give me a normal temp reading on my guage. The Check Engine light was on the whole time (of course!).

My conclusion - the temp gauge in this 1996 cluster is OBD II compliant (needs to get its signal from the coolant temp sensor) and cannot read the temp sender from the firewall. I may get a coolant temp sensor from a 97 and if it has three prongs it might work (the one on my 94 has two...one ground(?) and one to the 'puter...a third one might be for the temp gauge).

Cheers,
R.

Just gotta find the right sender... jeep was kinda tricky with the whole gauge set ups and changes and stuff over the years... i have 99 XJ gauges in my 97XJ... after 97 all the swaps should be even, just plug and play - it's that easy. anything below 97, there might be issues, but don't worry! it's just another project !!!

As the owner of a 96 who did the gauge cluster swap,let me set a few things right--
A 96 has the OBDII,There are 2 temp sensors,The sensor in the thermostat housing for the ECU ,2 the sender on the rear of the head for either a guage or light.
92-96 sensor w/guage -56027012 --for XJ
this is for a ZJ 4.0 w/gauge-56004815
97-01--gauge get reading from the sensor in t-stat housing
I my case I already had an aftermarket gauge (elect) so I did not use the temp guage in the cluster
Wayne